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Post by dtmd on Mar 4, 2007 23:55:30 GMT -5
What's up w/ the random factor. the fighting is horrilbe. no offense, it "says" you win the whole match and then you lose... also, i've had instances where i'll fight people 2-3 levels lower and i wont win until around 7 or 8 matches! if the player is lower than you. it should be nearly an automatic win. since the opposite is true for higher level players. (just saying and all)
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Post by suavisimo on Mar 5, 2007 0:00:34 GMT -5
I disagree.
IF you employ strategy and your opponent does not, you should have a higher chance of winning.
The stage of the game we're at now, you don't have strategies to employ, therefor the random factors kicks in.
Don't expect combat to stay the way it is for very long. But for now, and in the future, level does not guarantee automatic success. If that were the case, the highest level would never be killed. What fun is that? Likewise, you'd be given ultimate griefing power and be able to farm brand new players like it was your job, and have NO chance of failure. Both of those things I believe are unwanted here, and we'll be doing our best to make sure that future systems won't be completely random (like now) and won't be completely based on level (like you suggest).
Instead it will be based on how you play the game.
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Post by suavisimo on Mar 5, 2007 8:49:03 GMT -5
This is kinda what beta is for. I'm not 100% sure myself, I didn't build the combat module. So from what I read here:- Each round, a random stat is picked. - Each time you level stats go up a random amount between 2 and 5 - Each round, you compare random stat + random number added. So the best path is not (what I originally thought) as level based. Example: Your "strength" stat goes up by 2 every level to 10. Someone else's "strength" stat goes up by 5 every level to 10. Whenever you fight that person and the "strength" stat comes up, you will most likely lose that round (20 + 24 < 50 + 3). This is a bit of a prelude to expose what will eventually become our defensive system. The goal is to play enough by attacking the most people to get an idea of who's stats you have a good command over and fight them. That's not to say though in an arbitrary number of levels that will change. NW2 is and always will be about how you play the game. If the leveling system "sucks" because you're not leveling, try changing your tactics.
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rafiqi
Ninja
"Hatsumomo..."
Posts: 60
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Post by rafiqi on Mar 5, 2007 11:21:17 GMT -5
What i've seen seems to reinforce what suavisimo has said....
There are some ninja who are much easier to take out than others, level is really only a rough guide to their strength.
Personally while levelling i suggest trying to balance attacking based on levels with xp gain...often is is worth getting less xp if you win more ^^
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Post by dtmd on Mar 5, 2007 11:48:37 GMT -5
yes, it is sorry bout this downspeak. i was dissapointed cause i kept getting my ass plastered lol.. so i figure i now have a strategy. (what about random numbers based on level) (higher level = higher chance of getting a higher number) (sorry if that confused you)
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Post by chrismonster on Mar 5, 2007 12:25:22 GMT -5
DMTD,
I have access to all the code and I still get my ass plastered in fisticuffs with the youngins.
Go figure.
I can't wait till we invent assassins...I'll show you all!
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Post by suavisimo on Mar 5, 2007 12:40:49 GMT -5
Right. I'm intrigued as well as how it's playing out. I definitely see its potential, and actually I'm seeing the framework of the combo system.
Again, keep testing and feedbacking as much as possible. Just understand that demands take time.
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Post by suavisimo on Mar 5, 2007 12:43:36 GMT -5
And to answer another question I missed:
Fighting someone does not lower their stamina. However, they are unable to be attacked if they have 0 stamina themselves.
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Post by camilo on Mar 5, 2007 19:18:42 GMT -5
shouldnt we have at least some degree of power over our characters leveling? maybe some extra points u can add urself to any stats u feel lacking?
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Post by dtmd on Mar 5, 2007 21:02:10 GMT -5
sounds good to me, like an actual rpg should have... anyways, chrismonster, i used you and level 3 three times just now lol... i wish we could see our stats.
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Post by suavisimo on Mar 6, 2007 8:55:18 GMT -5
I will inevitably have this scribed on my tombstone:
It is BETA. We appreciate suggestions. The game will change drastically before the full release. Thank you for your patience.
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Post by chrismonster on Mar 6, 2007 10:49:12 GMT -5
Just like real life, I have a reputation for being easy.
I should start an alt and level off myself.
(Sounds dirty, no?)
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Post by dtmd on Mar 8, 2007 0:23:37 GMT -5
lol.. wow, ur in the staff and you're multi-ing lol... pretty laaammee lol ;D
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Post by shadowweaver on Mar 8, 2007 10:41:00 GMT -5
well i think that the fighting system is still weird.(trying not to bash) I'm lvl 22 and have to fight lvl 13 in order to get exp. I fight people my lvl or even 3 4 lvls lower and i never win...i've wasted over 1000 stamina trying to fight chars about my lvl and have yet to win. sort of...weird. All of you say stratage, but how can i implument stratagie if i can't tell their class(Fisheman cokk w/e) I only know they are fighters and their lvl so how am i suppose to lvl quick if I'm always unlucky and don't get the states that I need to do anything? Personally I have always loved the idea of choosing yourself where to put your state points depending on how you want to build your char. Like an assassin needs to be stealthy and quite so build a stat that increases that. a fighter needs to be strong. and make it so that even if your a warrior you can build it to be a speedy and hard to hit warrior that in the ned will outlast a more brute force baised warrior. like at lvl up you gain a certain amount of points to disperce into your stats as you choose, and the points are determind by lvl and exp. but then again thats just me. have fun guys I just wanted to vent since i had over 12000 stamina and only grew 15 lvls where as there are peeps at lvl 45 already...must be me then...
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Post by dtmd on Mar 8, 2007 18:59:58 GMT -5
i've had same problem , im level 18 and i could only level 2 levels last night w/ over 4k stamina. i had to fight level 13's recieving little to none exp for it. so i decided to start my auto-clicker and left the comp. sort of annoying having to kill that low. I mean, yeah strategy is kewl and all but until then, it sucks because you have ZERO control over your char. all you do is fight and lose. some times win. I started two days after everyone and im level 18 only and there are level 45's. Should either temporarily dump the random stat check until class and stat control is ready, or restart everyone at 1 once that component is completed. (just my opinion) (im not saying it sucks. Im just dissapointed that once you get ahead like that (45 : 18 in 2 days) it's not really fair. cause like you guys said, it chooses a random stat and compares them. What good is that if you dont have control over your stats? When you level it does them *randomly* (saying this out of what i've seen) and you are just like "ok, oh well. hope it doesn't choose *strength* or w/e" To sum this big stupid blubbering rant up: "No control over skills = bad. Especially while it randomly chooses a skill to use, and there is no way to view what skills you are good at." (i will reiterate, "I am a VERY OPINIONATED PERSON (as you can all tell) and i am not affraid to voice my opions. IF you disagree, good for you, i dont care. Sorry, no hard feelings. I just seriously dont care. . I am sorry for bombing you guys at NW every ten seconds but that's the kind of things i do. I try to debug everything i see. Please dont bomb me back. I am very impressed w/ EVERYTHING that you guys have done and wish i could get the same accomplished. ") (also, im a long-winded person. That is when it comes to stuff i care about.) ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Post by dtmd on Mar 8, 2007 19:03:16 GMT -5
*Tells self to "SHUT UP!"*
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Post by captainnoob on Mar 8, 2007 22:07:36 GMT -5
You'd think you'd learn after 10 unsuccessful attempts that fighting those anywhere near you is a bad idea. NW2 is keeping the tradition of killing those of lower level as the best leveling strategy.
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Post by dtmd on Mar 9, 2007 7:54:16 GMT -5
yeah, when i get on, i usually have anywher from 800 - 2,3k stamina so i usually *test the water* around my guy to see if im getting lucky that day or not. If not, i go to the second teens page and let loose getting 25 - 37 experience all day long
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Post by Beagle on Mar 9, 2007 15:46:32 GMT -5
Hey all,
I'm glad that the combat system is actually creating discussion. I know there are problems and shortfalls in the system. It's not all that fun, honestly, and it does make it harder to level off people near you. The random element of stat increases forces underdogs into the system, and not everyone is equal.
We have lots of plans for making combat interesting, so your suggestions are well taken and we'll keep listening to what's being said to make sure our next version is better than the last.
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Post by dagonundone on Mar 9, 2007 18:18:10 GMT -5
Hm, the one thing I want right now is maybe get a look at my own stats. I know what they go up by each lvl, but I am not sure if there is a place to see my own stats. If there is, can someone tell me?
Also, since we are going on stratagy and such, I would suggest maybe not being able to see other people's stats. After all, how does that mean stratagy? Maybe it would involve a sort of guessing game and such to figure out if you can beat them or not. That way, a low level person who has one main strong stat may be able to beat a higher level. This may make more people ticked off, but I just want to suggest perhaps a bit more stratagy.
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Post by dtmd on Mar 10, 2007 9:31:44 GMT -5
or maybe you can see there stats, as 1 of two things.
1. as a special power that costs 100 stamina or something. 2. only once a day. (meaning you can see a player's stats once out of all the times you attack him/her that day.)
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Post by Exia on Mar 11, 2007 12:32:34 GMT -5
your talking about sight from the white ninja class.
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Post by captainnoob on Mar 11, 2007 20:14:29 GMT -5
You should be able to make attacks on people in the same area as you. So only the people that are in certain towns. Or mabe get a surprise attack if you attack someone when you're on top of a tree, so you jump on them. Or if you're in the woods you could attack anyone else in the woods. Stuff like that would rock.
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Post by dtmd on Mar 11, 2007 20:55:25 GMT -5
yes, that would lead to strategic logout places. That is once we can see our stats. For example: if your character was better at a certain skill, different regions on the map would give boosts to certain skills. Woods : Guile (or w/e) , Dojo : Strength (or w/e) you get my point ;D
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Post by chrismonster on Mar 12, 2007 10:28:04 GMT -5
Be careful what you wish for...
But seriously, good suggestions, thanks! Nice to see people tossing out ideas again. We DO hear them. Coincidentally, we have some of our own. Stay tuned.
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Post by Beagle on Mar 12, 2007 11:11:14 GMT -5
I like the idea of areas unlocking powers or modifying skills. I have no idea how we'd handle it in a generic way, but I like it and it will probably end up in the "features to add after the game is officially released" list.
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rafiqi
Ninja
"Hatsumomo..."
Posts: 60
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Post by rafiqi on Mar 12, 2007 12:28:35 GMT -5
I was thinking that in theory combat is likely to get even harder in future...with clan halls and whatnot. Also players choosing their own builds....however thats probably a good thing considering that levelling is a bit too quick atm.
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Post by Exia on Mar 12, 2007 17:17:52 GMT -5
i think it would be funny if the forest was bigger so you have a higher chance of actually getting lost.
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Post by chrismonster on Mar 12, 2007 19:33:54 GMT -5
I'm changing my sig...
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