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Post by Jattonfire on Aug 7, 2010 18:19:36 GMT -5
Attempting to attack them takes up 1 turn. I'm assuming it's a bug unless it was intended for some reason. Also new players are experiencing difficulty rebirthing. People are also experiencing some sort of lag doing whatever. and apparently a newer player is having problems reviving when they have been killed, also the game has slowed a lot when buying items...
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Post by Tchalvak on Aug 7, 2010 23:06:39 GMT -5
Hmmm, I'll have to check whether the "you can't attack another ninja so fast" system works right (It often hasn't). Until the timing of that system is working, it is necessary for splurious attacks against dead enemies to take turns, to attach a cost to simply refreshing the attack page against an enemy continually as they try to revive, for example.
The issue with buying items is that there is now an ad on the shop page. The content on the work page wasn't enough to make the ads shown on ninjawars actually interesting (e.g. they would talk about dentistry instead of ninja dentistry, or small pomeranians instead of small ninja pomeranians), so I put it on two more pages that I knew would have the right content to make them topical. That means that they're on the shop, the work page, and sometimes the village.
Those with Firefox & adblock turned on may experience the lag without seein' the ad.
Now new players having issues reviving, that I have no explanation for, please let us know if you find any more details, I'll test on my side when I get the time.
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Post by Tchalvak on Aug 7, 2010 23:35:55 GMT -5
Ah, I see the "not resurrecting", it's probably related to free healing situations (level under 5, or kills under 1). I'll try to fix that up as soon as I can.
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Post by Jattonfire on Aug 7, 2010 23:39:01 GMT -5
Now new players having issues reviving, that I have no explanation for, please let us know if you find any more details, I'll test on my side when I get the time. Made a throwaway acct for it, when I press heal on the sidebar I get this: When I go to the shrine and press resurrect I get this: Both situations DO NOT resurrect me. Those with Firefox & adblock turned on may experience the lag without seein' the ad. No wonder, thanks. Edit: Well, I can't seem to delete my throwaway account now, this is another problem I'd assume. Small text problem, isn't really a bug but it's a pretty small thing to fix: How do I use my skills? Different Ninjas have different skills based on your ninja color (red, white, blue, and black). Either click the Skills link from the menu for any skills that you can use on yourself, or find an enemy ninja's profile page and click a skill to use it on them. ^^Notice it leaves a class out? The same can probably be said for anywhere else that states all classes.
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Post by Jattonfire on Aug 8, 2010 4:52:45 GMT -5
Resolved, thread pretty much redundant now. Except for minor text-based mishaps such as switching ninja classes and the exclusion of gray ninjas from some texts.
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Post by Beagle on Aug 8, 2010 21:28:52 GMT -5
Thank you for your effort, Jattonfire. We really appreciate it you taking the time and care into reporting, testing, and following up on this. You are an honorable Ninja, indeed.
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Post by 13 on Aug 9, 2010 11:45:12 GMT -5
the lurker list (with show dead ninja) no longer seems to trigger on simply opening profile links, which it used to... this makes it harder to tell if dead ninja are setting up, or if someone is repeating attacks continuously by whatever means in hope that you rez. i'm not sure why you guys changed this, or if it's even unintentional, but it's less effective than the previous function of the lurker list, unless of course u want ppl to be able to mail one another undetected and exploit this in other ways.
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Post by Tchalvak on Aug 10, 2010 18:33:37 GMT -5
Yeah, being a lurker is only really supposed to reflect when person last attacked, that's just a fix of a bug that has been existing for a while.
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Post by 13 on Aug 11, 2010 21:41:32 GMT -5
that's too bad it half ruins stealth and doesn't detect lurking, but i see what your saying.
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Post by Tchalvak on Aug 13, 2010 18:48:34 GMT -5
Well, your definition of lurking is different than mine. I don't have any problem with someone logging on, staying silent on chat, and not attacking... ...and having no-one be the wiser.
But if you engage in combat, then you become fair game.
Not sure how that ruins stealth.
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Post by annihilate on Aug 13, 2010 20:26:11 GMT -5
By ruining stealth, I believe he means the ability to kill someone, and commit suicide quick enough so the victim is unable to identify the culprit.
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Post by 13 on Aug 15, 2010 11:00:47 GMT -5
previously u could lurk as u define it just fine. loading someones profile however (like targeting them) would show up on the lurker list (with show dead ninja) so an attacker could be noticed b4 they chose to actually rez and strike. now this is not the case. u have given those lurkers an advantage is all i am saying. they can also register targets in the combat menu to see exactly how much damage they need to do, all undetected without any cost or risk.
what i meant by stealth being ruined, the lurker list since it's inception has prevented live anonymous attacks, anyone can just check the lurker list if they are online at the time (show dead ninja) and see who got them. stealth at this time became nothing more than a force-field against certain moves. tho obviously still ok for secret attacks against people who aren't online.
perhaps i lack understanding with regard to the projected evolution of the game, but i see a lot of changes past and present as kinda arbitrary and questionable, rather than improving living conditions in ninja village.
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Post by 13 on Aug 15, 2010 11:06:14 GMT -5
oh yeah and ice bolts stop functioning on targets with 4 turns or less... whats up with that?
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Post by Tchalvak on Aug 17, 2010 10:57:04 GMT -5
Re: Ice bolt...
Expect "removal of an opponents turns" to stop being an option entirely sometime in the future. It's simply not a fair tactic. All the appropriate skills and items that do so will be repurposed, so that they're still useful... ...but taking away an opponents turns will stop being an available tactic. Ideally it will be replaced with real defensive tactics, and limiting of attacks between two unique players.
Re: Lurking.
The purpose of the lurking list is to show people who have been actively attacking, and thus would be fun to attack yourself, for an active battle with someone online as opposed to a passive attack on someone who is offline. As such, viewing another ninja's profile doesn't qualify. Also, the purpose doesn't tie in with stealth, or with anything else, really. It's just there to let you attack someone who might be around and active to attack back, even if they haven't been revealing that they're online by chatting. Not much more.
The lurking list doesn't show dead ninja because you can't do anything fun to dead ninja, so there's no point in linking to them. When they revive, they'll be on the list again. *shrugs*
Re: Evolution of the game.
The game evolves slowly, ideally towards a better future. But as we go, certain changes will appear arbitrary because we're changing things 1 by 1 (even if we release them in groups). Overall, we're looking at creating a more even/fair and especially, playable, game. But single changes along the way are going to have a variety of complex reasons behind them beyond just, say, fun.
Anyway, with this one it was just a matter of viewing profiles being checked as if it were an attack when it's only an observation (even if it's the step before an attack), which was essentially a bug. So the reversal of that behavior is just due to fixing the underlying bug that's been around for a long time.
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Post by 13 on Aug 17, 2010 14:25:07 GMT -5
yeah i agree (as much as i like ice) it's kinda contrary to people playing. anyway with my previous statements based on existing tactics/metagame which are apparently obsolete (gonna become some other thing) then i there is probably no point in discussing what's seemingly relevant now.
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Post by Balsac on Aug 17, 2010 18:07:02 GMT -5
dont take out ice, taking turns is a good thing
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Post by Tchalvak on Aug 17, 2010 19:00:52 GMT -5
Feel free to argue in favor of it, but I think any argument that it's good can generally be refuted by saying "Ah, now what if you were the -other- guy, losing his turns?".
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaany benefit that comes from taking away an enemy's turns should be duplicated, but it should be duplicated in different ways. For example: the defensive benefit of taking away an opponent's turns, so they can't attack you back right away, is something that should be duplicated by powerful skills (e.g. nerve strike/paralysis of an opponent). Essentially the -one- thing that shouldn't be retained is the loss of turns itself, as that actually prevent others from playing to their full capacity, which isn't fair.
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Post by meant4war on Aug 18, 2010 17:50:50 GMT -5
Well, since this is ninja wars, I think you should be able to ice people to 0. and you say its not fair to the other player, but thats how ninja are, they don't play fair, they do what they can to disable their opponent. by a sneak ice attack, sure, if you catch it fast enough, then you can react, and defend yourself, but if you don't catch it, you've been succesfully ambushed. Well, thats just my two cents.
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Post by Balsac on Aug 18, 2010 19:12:29 GMT -5
i have been on the other end many many many many many many many many many many times, i can go on, i even got it when you could ice someone to zero stealth them so that you couldnt use a speed on your self and you were left till the next reset and if you didnt kill your self you were ice to zero again and stealth so nobody could use on on you or kill you execpt a red , and you could not play for hours., and hours if there was good team work going on , AND IM STILL INFAVOR OF KEEPING ICE SCROLLS, if someone cant deal with being iced to zero they need to sac up , people can get to a point were they dont need to worry about turns very very fast now taking turns should stay
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Post by daisygirl on Aug 19, 2010 21:30:46 GMT -5
I think the ice scrolls should stay. This is a game of fighting at all costs. If that means you loose your turns then suck it up. No different then a Dim..meaning there isn't anything to fight off a dim...you just suck it up. Ice scrolls is just another form of fighting and the people who are complaining about getting iced should suck it up and deal with it. Everyone has gotten iced at some point or another.
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Post by Tchalvak on Aug 19, 2010 23:25:58 GMT -5
I'm fine with the discussion and whatnot here, but I think I need to clarify a little here:
The problem with ice scrolls isn't the scorched earth genocide of your opponent. Dominating an enemy is all fine and good. The problem is that it -prevents- play on the scale of that whole day. I'm fine with skills that render an enemy helpless -against you-. We can implement those to replace the ice effects. They won't be cheap or simple, but they can exist, for skilled, powerful players to use (note the difference that I'm implying there between that and the current ice effects).
What will be going away is the complete ability to suppress an opponent's opportunity to play for the rest of the day, because without using much or any of their turns of their own accord, they've nevertheless lost the opportunity to do stuff with those turns.
If we do it right, we can achieve one (the ability to fuck up an opponent so that they won't be attacking you again any time soon) without the other (taking away the rest of their play choices). Again, I'm thinking things like paralysis and weakness debuffs that would stop an opponent from attacking back for a time.
The overall point I'm getting at is that the goal is to let players enjoy the game and -play- the various parts of the game, even if they aren't being effective in combat because they've already "lost" in the combat area of the game for a while. Just, you know, keep that in mind.
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Post by Aquazure on Dec 28, 2010 17:32:33 GMT -5
being an ice ninja myself im fond of tht idea. how about ice freezing people? not taking turns but freezing them for 20-30 minutes, they couldnt retaliate imediatly but theyd hav turns when they thawed. and to keep the turn sapping tactic use a chilled status that makes everything cost an extra turn, then they can either wait out the chill to save turns or fight back at the cost of losing turns. i think that is a nice compromise to the turn sapping?
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Post by Beagle on Jan 3, 2011 15:34:47 GMT -5
I like the idea of a speed debuff that makes all actions take additional turns. Good idea!
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